Homeoidiocy

6th December 2007

posted in Politics by themaiden |

What makes you sick? Well, whatever it is put some of it in solution and dilute it 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 times. That will make you better. Never mind that “the laws of chemistry state that there is a limit to the dilution that can be made without losing the original substance altogether” and that Hahnemann, homeopathy’s founder, “himself realized that there is virtually no chance that even one molecule of original substance would remain after extreme dilutions“, because you still have ““spirit-like” essence—”no longer perceptible to the senses”—which cures by reviving the body’s “vital force.””

Ok. But…

Homeopaths would be fine, if they could just shut up about serious stuff, like Aids, malaria, and MMR.

This week I received a flier for a conference being organised by the Society of Homeopaths (“representing professional homeopaths”), the biggest professional organisation for homeopaths in the UK. “Join us at this one-day Symposium in London for a fascinating insight into the role of homeopathy in treating HIV/AIDS.”

It’s a pretty fascinating flier. “In searching for an effective remedy for treating the AIDS-epidemic in Africa, the UK-homeopath Peter Chappell discovered a method to design remedies fitting the totality of a disease. These remedies are now known as PC-remedies.” In case you’re wondering how he makes them, Peter explains on his own site how he “creates a holistic mirror energy/information set to the disease using a special process he does not yet disclose.”

He also sells energy wave patterns on iTunes. They sound like jazz – I am listening to Aids one right now - but this is simply the “carrier”, on which the healing “resonance” is “engrafted”. “Modern quantum physics is confirming resonance works on all levels of existence,” he says.

The Society’s conference materials are gushing. “He [their lecturer] observed that in just a few days or weeks patients become symptom free and able to return to their jobs and schools or to look after their children again. Harry believes that using the PC1 remedy, the AIDS epidemic can be called to a halt, and that homeopaths are the ones that can do it.” On his own site, Harry is even more explicit: “PC1 for HIV/AIDS works”. How well? “In all cases.”

Bad Science » Homeopathy gives you Aids

… treating AIDS by engrafting healing resonance onto carrier jazz created via a holistic mirror? Treating AIDS with music? That is downright psychotic. And ought to be illegal. Of course, I guess I just don’t get it.

I feel you have not researched the many scholars around the globe that are researching the quantum biological perspective. A few key biophysicists are gaining knowledge that there are subatomic fields that interpenetrate and structure the molecular level. These fields can directly relate to how homeopathy works. YOU DO NOT NEED ANY MOLECULES OF THE SUBSTANCE IN THE REMEDY TO AFFECT THESE UNDERLYING FIELDS. A SUBATOMIC WAVE FIELD THAT IS CARRYED BY THE WATER OR SUGAR IN THE REMEDY IS INTERACTING WITH THE SUBATOMIC FIELDS UNDERLYING THE PHYSICAL MATTER OF THE PATIENT. The problem is our limited technology can only measure a limited band of the energy spectrum. WE ARE NOT THAT ADVANCED AS A CIVILISATION. JUST WATCH THE NEWS.

From the reader responses at QuackWatch

Really, I love insanity like “quantum biological perspective” and “subatomic fields that interpenetrate and structure the molecular level”. Snake Oil 101: Explain your quackery in terms of the latest and most confusing real science you can find. The more difficult and obscure the real science the better. No one is going to check. And, using the word ‘quantum’ sounds so high-techie and advanced.

I also love things like this.

Homeopathic practices tend to be from the biblical roots of good natural medicine. There are millions that will fight any intrusion on homeopathy and its tenets. God have mercy on the persecutors.

From the reader responses at QuackWatch

Right. That says “Good science”. Hmmm… nevermind that it doesn’t sit so well with the previous justification of homeopathy.

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This entry was posted on Thursday, December 6th, 2007 at 8:27 am and is filed under Politics. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

1 On December 6th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

Here is one simple and open statement for all those who are against homeopathy. You could be individual / organization, patient / doctor. Can you honestly give one single reason to be against homeopathy. I said honestly. If you are honest with no prejudice and have patient’s welfare as topmost priority, if you do not have any selfish motive, can you then give single reason to be against homeopathy. I invite you to write about ‘your’ reason. I will explain how ignorance has fooled you. If you honestly believe in welfare of patients and humanity you can not have any reason to be against homeopathy. That is my challenge. One thing is said about homeopathy that it is not scientific. On what basis you can say that. Around the world its results can be verified. And what is scientific. FIRST RULE OF SCIENCE IS NOT TO ACCEPT OR REJECT ANYTHING WITHOUT FACTS. But unfortunately all those so called scientific people start talking about homeopathy without knowing ABC of homeopathy.That shows that it is not logic but some other motive that drives them to talk about homeopathy. Learn the basics of homeopathy, see its result then say anything. You will only be delighted by its wonderful results. If you have doubt, ask me, I will tell you how it works. Homeopathy is a blessing for mankind. Do not try to kill it because of your selfish motive or ignorance. It will be a crime against humanity. A big Crime.

2 On December 7th, 2007, StealthBadger said:

“Can you honestly give one single reason to be against homeopathy.”

Yup.

It doesn’t work. You’re wrong about the first rule of science, too. A hypothesis is useless unless it not only describes past and current events, but can also predict future ones. Homeopathy’s vague justifications offer unsatisfactory explanations in all three. Also, anyone who tries to tie homeopathy’s alleged resonances with quantum physics not only doesn’t understand it, they don’t understand physics period. Let’s not even get started about biology, kay? Homeopathy doesn’t offer real explanations. Like religion, it continually retreats behind the curtain of ignorance that is the limit of our current knowledge.

3 On December 7th, 2007, themaiden said:

Stealth,

My first reactions to that question was, “You’ve got to be kidding?” then “Is this a trick question?”

I thought, honestly, that I had given some reasons to disbelieve homeopathy. I guess pointing out the blatant conceptual stupidity of the practice just isn’t good enough for some people.

4 On December 7th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

Sorry your info is not based on facts. Homeopathy is not vague. Its principles are clear. Every action of physician is guided by principles. And there is nothing hidden. You can read it, apply it and see results yourself. It strongly examines past and present and condition and very well predicts future outcome. All this shows that those who are against are so ignorant about its working. I again say if you are honest (ask yourself) then why it is so difficult, read it use it and see results. And if you have any doubt ask me I will explain. And if you want proof, most welcome come to my clinic and see by your own eyes.

5 On December 8th, 2007, themaiden said:

Dr. Sharma.

Having ‘principles’ doesn’t automatically mean that homeopathy’s justifications are not vague. Voodoo has principles. Physiognomy has principles. Chiromancy has principles. Hell, faith healing has principles. And guess what? “You can read it, apply it and see results yourself”, or so some people claim. The unfortunate fact is that there is no respectable evidence that any of it actually works. Contrary to your claim homeopathy does not “very well predicts future outcome” unless that prediction begins with “if you take a sugar pill then…”

The National Center for Complimentary and Alternative Medicine prints a fairly damning couple of charts, especially Appendix II. There is another collection of reports here.

By the way, this “if you are honest” spiel is getting on my nerves real fast. Such rhetoric is some combination of 1) an appeal to emotion, 2) poisoning the well, 3) loading the question, and 4) a backhanded ad hominem. Take your pick.

As to proof, the burden of prof is on you. You claim some veracity to homeopathic nonsense. It is your job to provide the evidence. Lets have it.

6 On December 9th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

what great scientific minded people. You do not want to read about homeopathic research. You dont want to see its results. You dont want to read clinical studies. You dont want to see its efficacy by using it. And you have scientific mind. Scientific mind is not blind. It is ready to think explore challenge observe and also must have honesty to accept truth. Alas all this is missing in so called scientific people. Homeopathy told more than 200 years ago about psychosomatic disease, about lifestyle induced diseases about beginning of disease much before its appearance clinically. All this science accept today. For more than 200 years humanity suffered because of dumb people like you ( or dishonest). Be blind but know that humanity is still suffering because of people like you. Homeopaths are honest to say that yes no science is perfect and humanity needs both. You must read about Dr C Hering who was designated to denounce homeopathy, he read it used it and became a true follower of it. Because he had the honesty and guts to question. You too can study and understand. But only if you have honesty and guts.

7 On December 10th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

Earth is Flat
Malaria by Mal Air

Such people are not new. They keep ignoring facts. But thank God all are not blind like them. Homeopathy is getting officially recognized even in USA & Canada as healing therapy.

http://www.boiron.com/en/htm/homeopathy-today/homeopathy-regulation.htm

and what, are they talking about research. This article tells why Columbia university is forming RESEARCH alliance with Dr Bannerjee

Dr. Pathak’s six year research on cancer cell lines has established on a cellular and molecular level the reasons why and how Dr. Banerji’s Ruta extracts work in putting the intracranial glioma tumors into remission. The primary effect of this particularly diluted solution is to immediately strengthen the chromosomal DNA segments called the Telomeres.

Pathak explains that the Telomeric portions act like the gate keepers or, body guards of the Chromosomal DNA, to which they are normally attached like end-caps. If these Telomeres are weakened by intrinsic or, other extraneous harmful causes, they can no longer protect the chromosomes. These weakened and broken chromosomes then abnormally join with each other, thus, forming new types abnormal cells which either die or, start to multiply. The later event gives rise to tumors and cancerous growths. These cancerous cells are usually treated with removal surgery and followed by Chemo and Radiation therapies by modern oncologists in a hospital environment.
Unlike Chemo and Radiation therapies which indiscriminately kill normal cells, bone marrow cells along with the cancer cells, the Ruta treatment acts quite differently. Once the Telomeres cells are strengthened by the Ruta the body’s own defense mechanism takes over and attacks not only the anomalous intracranial glioma growths but seems also to induce healthy cell divisions in the normal blood. This makes the patients recover their strength and feel healthier very quickly. While this technique showed various grades of positive in-vitro (In test tubes) results on many other types of human and mouse cancers, according to Pathak, the best results were seen on the human intracranial glioma.

Are you still counting molecules ??

8 On December 11th, 2007, themaiden said:

Dr. Sharma,

I have a couple of requests. Every comment you post contains a fair quantity of insult/personal attack. Please stop that rude behavior. Second, if you do not start responding to my comments directly I will simply ignore you. You post. I respond specifically to what you say and then you respond with something that doesn’t address the issues I raise. That is annoying.

Now…

You do not want to read about homeopathic research.

False, as ought to be obvious by my post and by my comments. Who is being dishonest here?

You dont want to see its results.

Again, false. Are you a mind reader as well?

You dont want to read clinical studies.

False. Again, who is being dishonest here?

You dont want to see its efficacy by using it.

Nor do I want to be treated by a psychic surgeon. I don’t see this as a failing.

Scientific mind is not blind.

Nor is scientific mind voodoo magic mind.

It is ready to think explore challenge observe and also must have honesty to accept truth.

Truth like, for example, most studies of homeopathy conclude that it doesn’t work? Is that the truth you mean?

Alas all this is missing in so called scientific people.

Oh? Because scientific people like actual evidence?

Homeopathy told more than 200 years ago about psychosomatic disease, about lifestyle induced diseases about beginning of disease much before its appearance clinically. All this science accept today.

And none of this has anything to do with magic energy water.

For more than 200 years humanity suffered because of dumb people like you ( or dishonest).

Ah, yes. Dumb and dishonest. That will get your point across. Which of us is behaving badly, Dr. Sharma? Which of us is resorting to ad hominem attacks?

Recognition by a government does not make something good science. That line of argument is about as logically flawed as it gets.

I read Pathak’s ruta study. I thought, where are the controls? Why the extra chemical? That is an almost unbelievable success rate? In other words, something is wrong with the study. Additionally, Pathak appears to have a miracle cure. If true, you’d expect it sweep the world in days, or weeks. Instead, very little has happened with it. Why? Conspiracy? Bad old medical doctors refusing to believe it? Look, if this worked a Big Pharmaceutical company would be on it minutes.

9 On December 12th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

I do not mean any disrespect to anyone. If someone is hurt, I regret. I have always written straight to point. I have only written to explain about homeopathy and its effectiveness. I do not mean to talk against any person or therapy.

10 On December 12th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

I never meant any disrespect to anyone. If anyone is hurt I regret. I have nothing against any person / therapy. I have only written about homeopathy and its effectiveness.

11 On December 12th, 2007, themaiden said:

Dr. Sharma,

You are welcome to write about homeopathy but do not pepper your posts with insults.

12 On December 13th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

There are many things (including many therapies) which might not be conclusively proved till date. That does not mean those things do not exist. Science itself is an ever evolving process. Many theories are proposed to be discarded later. I agree that one must be extremely careful when it comes to people’s health. And I am myself against quackery. But when we talk about homeopathy, its effect has been seen by neutral people worldwide. And effect I mean to the extent improvement in pathological states. That is certainly not psychological, placebo or toxic effect of impurities. A small study of few people where researchers were giving medicines not following homeopathic principles, it was bound to fail. I give you one example if you give aconite to all people with fever, it will sure not help. But if you carefully see that the symptom picture is matching that of aconite, it will 100% succeed. This mistake has been committed by researchers and when they do not get result they say it is not working.

13 On December 13th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

Please visit following for research in homeopathy. It has used control and double blind method. It is the government recognized research centre.

http://ccrhindia.org/

14 On December 13th, 2007, themaiden said:

Dr. Sharma,

CcrhIndia.org is a mildly interesting site but I see none of the research you claim is there.

Once again I ask that you respond directly to my comments on this thread. I am not sure why that is such a difficult thing for you to do.

Yes, many things aren’t proven and that doesn’t mean that these things don’t exist. They might exist. So what? ‘Not proven’ does not mean ‘therefore it exists’. It means ‘insufficient evidence’. Are you admitting that homeopathy offers insufficient evidence?

If you don’t like the studies being done, homeopaths are welcome to construct studies of their own but those studies have to be done right and can’t be fatally flawed by methodological error and data cherry picking, etc.

I am sure you’ve got some anecdotal stories of success. What proof have you that it isn’t psychological or just chance? That is homeopathy’s problem really. If is worked as stated it should be easy enough to dispel these questions. It isn’t that complicated.

No offense but do you realize how quackish this sounds– “But if you carefully see that the symptom picture is matching that of aconite, it will 100% succeed”? 100%? Nothing works 100% and really the only people who ever claim that kind of success rate are charlatans.

15 On December 13th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

At times written words fail to convey meaning. When I say 100 % yes it definitely means that if the symptom picture is exactly of aconite than it will bring relief provided right potency and frequency is chosen. This is like if you give some antibiotic in right dose and after checking its sensitivity, it will not fail. This conveys your confidence and confidence comes after you have done something yourself again and again. You are right nothing is 100 % perfect. So is homeopathy and so is conventional medicine. (someone said that allopathy is not right word to use) Remember we are dealing with suffering of humanity and nothing should be accepted or rejected casually. I welcome thorough research in homeopathy. But I object to dismissal of homeopathy just because a few researchers who were not sure how to apply homeopathy conducted study on 60 odd people and concluded homeopathy does not work. This is casual approach. Let there be some combined (eminent people from both fields) study which should be comprehensive and unbiased. Regarding CCRH, I will try to meet them and get facts related to studies. I will then post them. Mind you I am a believer but not a blind believer. For seven years I saw its results than took it as a career that too after recognized qualification.

16 On December 15th, 2007, Dr Sunil Sharma said:

Dr. Sharma,

It is great to hear from you. The paper that we wrote with Dr. Prasanta Banerji and his son, Pratip Banerji on Ruta is published in the International J. of Oncology 23: 975-982, 2003. I am a strong believer of Homeopathy and M.D. Anderson Cancer Center is going to start clinical trials with some these H. drugs on cancer patients. I was recently invited by the Office of Cancer Complementary and Alternative Medicine CAM), National Cancer Institute of N.I.H. to speak in a conference in Bethesda, Maryland. The title of the conference was: Cancer Researchers and CAM Practitioners: Fostering Collaborations; Advancing the Science, on October 22-23, 2007. What lacks in H. medicine is the scientific evidence, molecular mechanism of action and so on. Those of us who are believers and have scientific background are now involved in homeopathic medicine research. National Cancer Institute (NCI) has allocated millions of dollars to do research on such medicines because they have seen cases that have been treated successfully by H. medicines. As a matter of fact. NCI is ready to offer now grants to Dr. Banerji for his research in Kolkata. Dr. Jeffrey White the Director of CAM has visited Dr. Banerji’s clinic in Kolkata many times and he is immensely impressed with his treatment results. On 18 October, 2007, Dr. Abdul Kalam, the former President Of India, visited M.D. Anderson Cancer Center and we had a great and very productive discussion with our Cancer Center President, Dr. John Mendelsohn who is very open minded to bring homeopathy and other ancient treatment modalities for cancer treatment.

This is enough for today. I will not have time and energy to participate in those threads.

Thanks,
Sen Pathak
Sen Pathak, Ph.D., F.N.A.Sc.
Distinguished Research Professor
Department of Cancer Genetics, Unit # 1010
U.T.M.D. Anderson Cancer Center
1515 Holcombe Boulevard
Houston, Texas 77030
Tel: (713) 563-1892
E-mail: spathak@mdanderson.org

17 On December 15th, 2007, themaiden said:

Dr. Sharma,

You seemed to have missed the point.

This is like if you give some antibiotic in right dose and after checking its sensitivity, it will not fail.

This is absolutely not correct. Antibiotics sometimes will fail. Confidence is one thing, but this is terrible overconfidence. I wouldn’t trust any doctor who uttered such a statement.

Your suggestion that homeopathy has been rejected by myself, or by science, due to one study involving 60 people– an assertion implied several times now– is misleading to be kind and patently false to be honest. Statements like this really damage your credibility. By following the links I have already provided anyone reading this thread can convince themselves that your assertion is false. That doesn’t help you case.

Why the name dropping Dr. Sharma? Name dropping is not argument, nor is it evidence.

18 On December 20th, 2007, Who exactly are the nice guys? | hell's handmaiden said:

[...] are prone to the same pattern. I’ve seen it with astrology. I’ve seen it with homeopathy. I’ve seen it with creationism of various stripes. In fact, this latter is the hands down [...]

19 On December 29th, 2007, A Homeopathy Grab Bag | hell's handmaiden said: